Topic: Consciousness

Camp: Agreement / Composite Qualia

Camp Statement History

Objected
Live
In Review
Old
Statement : Definition:

Computationally bound elemental intrinsic qualities like redness and greenness.


In addition to this being the definition of consciousness, we consider this to be the definition of subsets of consciousness such as Intentionality, free will, higher order knowledge, intersubjective knowledge, self-awareness, desire, love, spirits, and all other similar concepts. These are all just computationally bound “composite qualitative experiences.”

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Submitter Nick Name : Brent_Allsop
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Statement : Definition:

Computationally bound elemental intrinsic qualities like redness and greenness.


In addition to this being the definition of consciousness, we consider this to be the definition of subsets of consciousness such as Intentionality, free will, higher order knowledge, intersubjective knowledge, self-awareness, desire, love, spirits, and all other similar concepts. These are all just computationally bound “composite qualitative experiences.”

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Submitter Nick Name : Brent_Allsop
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Statement : Consciousness is the unified world of conscious knowledge or awareness composed of phenomenal properties of physical matter properly configured in our brain.
We believe perception is real, representative, and part of our brain. We agree with the 'Nature Has Ineffable Phenomenal Properties' camp on the hard problem. of consciousness.
When we look at a strawberry patch, there is something in our brain with red phenomenal properties representing the strawberries, and something with green phenomenal properties representing the green leaves. This unified 3D red and green knowledge or awareness in our brain is what enables us to consciously know where the strawberries are in the patch of green leaves. We think our red and green knowledge are the real strawberries out beyond our eyes. But this is a deception, or optimization, played on us by our creator since such awareness that our phenomenal knowledge is only in our brain isn't necessary for survival.
In human minds, there are also many other 'cognitive' abilities and semantics tied to this conscious awareness such as memory, introspection awareness about the phenomenal nature of red, green, and their phenomenal differences, the words for strawberries and leaves, the ability to imagine eating the most red ones and recollection of how good they taste, and so on. Such cognitive abilities certainly also includes the perception process which results in this phenomenal awareness, and our ability to chose the strawberry to pick from amongst the leaves based on this awareness. We look forward to when these cognitive abilities achieve a more accurate and complete representation of our phenomenal knowledge being in our head, and only representing the cause and effect behavior of the world beyond our senses.
While some people may find value in defining consciousness to be a kind of 'suitcase' term where it includes all these kinds of cognitive abilities, memories, and behavioral mechanisms, and so on, as necessary to be considered conscious, we think all this is distracting from what is the most important key feature of consciousness or its phenomenal nature.
We believe that a simple brain with no memory (other than the phenomenal representation itself), no perception ability (i.e. it only dreams its awareness rather than 'looking at something') no behavioral ability to chose or pick a strawberry, no cognitive ability to associate words and such with the phenomenal knowledge of red and green, and so on, would still be sufficient to fall within a definition of something that is phenomenally conscious.
We believe such will be verifiable via some kind of 'effing' of the ineffable process as described in the consciousness is real camp of the hard problem of consciousness topic rather than any observation of mere behavior.
While the achievement of understanding of how these other cognitive abilities will certainly be important and very necessary, doing so will be nothing in comparison to the most important discovery, which will be that of the phenomenal properties of nature. We believe this phenomenal discovery will be by far, the most important and world changing scientific achievement to date. And we believe that once this discovery of phenomenal properties is achieved, the rest of the cognitive abilities, and how they tie in, will quickly follow.
Certainly, when we use our cause and effect scientific instruments and senses to look for whatever it is that has ineffable red in our brain, we shouldn't expect it to reflect 650 nanometer (red) light. But certainly once we discover what it is that does have this ineffable property along with how it behaves, we will certainly be able to reproduce or 'eff' such in other minds. Even if the brain isn't resulting in any behavior, or passing some Turing test, we would still consider it to be conscious. At least if this falsifiable ' phenomenal theory of consciousness' turns out to be the correct one.
Oh THAT is what salt tastes like, the computer might say after so effing in the future. We also believe the most important thing to ask in a 'Turing Test' is merely something along the lines of: "What is red like for you?" Once you can answer that in an effable way, all the rest will come easy.



Edit summary : Add one final comment.
Submitted on :
Submitter Nick Name : Brent_Allsop
Go live Time :
Statement :
Consciousness is the unified world of conscious knowledge or awareness composed of phenomenal properties of physical matter properly configured in our brain.
We believe perception is real, representative, and part of our brain. We agree with the 'Nature Has Ineffable Phenomenal Properties' camp on the hard problem. of consciousness.
When we look at a strawberry patch, there is something in our brain with red phenomenal properties representing the strawberries, and something with green phenomenal properties representing the green leaves. This unified 3D red and green knowledge or awareness in our brain is what enables us to consciously know where the strawberries are in the patch of green leaves. We think our red and green knowledge are the real strawberries out beyond our eyes. But this is a deception, or optimization, played on us by our creator since such awareness that our phenomenal knowledge is only in our brain isn't necessary for survival.
In human minds, there are also many other 'cognitive' abilities and semantics tied to this conscious awareness such as memory, introspection awareness about the phenomenal nature of red, green, and their phenomenal differences, the words for strawberries and leaves, the ability to imagine eating the most red ones and recollection of how good they taste, and so on. Such cognitive abilities certainly also includes the perception process which results in this phenomenal awareness, and our ability to chose the strawberry to pick from amongst the leaves based on this awareness. We look forward to when these cognitive abilities achieve a more accurate and complete representation of our phenomenal knowledge being in our head, and only representing the cause and effect behavior of the world beyond our senses.
While some people may find value in defining consciousness to be a kind of 'suitcase' term where it includes all these kinds of cognitive abilities, memories, and behavioral mechanisms, and so on, as necessary to be considered conscious, we think all this is distracting from what is the most important key feature of consciousness or its phenomenal nature.
We believe that a simple brain with no memory (other than the phenomenal representation itself), no perception ability (i.e. it only dreams its awareness rather than 'looking at something') no behavioral ability to chose or pick a strawberry, no cognitive ability to associate words and such with the phenomenal knowledge of red and green, and so on, would still be sufficient to fall within a definition of something that is phenomenally conscious.
We believe such will be verifiable via some kind of 'effing' of the ineffable process as described in the consciousness is real camp of the hard problem of consciousness topic rather than any observation of mere behavior.
While the achievement of understanding of how these other cognitive abilities will certainly be important and very necessary, doing so will be nothing in comparison to the most important discovery, which will be that of the phenomenal properties of nature. We believe this phenomenal discovery will be by far, the most important and world changing scientific achievement to date. And we believe that once this discovery of phenomenal properties is achieved, the rest of the cognitive abilities, and how they tie in, will quickly follow.
Certainly, when we use our cause and effect scientific instruments and senses to look for whatever it is that has ineffable red in our brain, we shouldn't expect it to reflect 650 nanometer (red) light. But certainly once we discover what it is that does have this ineffable property along with how it behaves, we will certainly be able to reproduce or 'eff' such in other minds. Even if the brain isn't resulting in any behavior, or passing some Turing test, we would still consider it to be conscious. At least if this falsifiable ' phenomenal theory of consciousness' turns out to be the correct one.
Oh THAT is what salt tastes like, the computer might say after so effing in the future. We also believe the most important thing to ask in a 'Turing Test' is merely something along the lines of: "What is red like for you?"


Edit summary : better define that all coagnative stuff is only destracting.
Submitted on :
Submitter Nick Name : Brent_Allsop
Go live Time :
Statement : Consciousness is the unified world of conscious knowledge or awareness composed of phenomenal properties of physical matter properly configured in our brain.
We believe perception is real, representative, and part of our brain. We agree with the 'Nature Has Ineffable Phenomenal Properties' camp on the hard problem. of consciousness.
When we look at a strawberry patch, there is something in our brain with red phenomenal properties representing the strawberries, and something with green phenomenal properties representing the green leaves. This 3D red and green knowledge or awareness in our brain is what enables us to consciously know where the best strawberries are in the patch of green leaves.
This red and green phenomenal knowledge unified into a 3D world of conscious awareness is the final result of the data processed from our senses. This phenomenal knowledge may also include additional semantic information such as the word for strawberry, a memory of sweetness for the reddest ones, and so on. This may also include the ability to retrospectively consider the nature of these red and green phenomenal properties, and the difference between them.
We believe that while these higher level introspective cognitive abilities and the semantic information attached to such phenomenal awareness is important, the raw phenomenal red and green phenomenal properties, and their categorical difference from mere behavior, is the most fundamentally important thing when considering what consciousness is.
Surely there is less intelligent life similarly using raw phenomenal properties to intelligently represent their world, without as many additional cognitive abilities which we have to retrospectively think about such. We believe such is what Thomas Nagal was referring to when he asked the question: "What is it like to be a bat". We of course know, behaviorally, what a bat is like. But what its conscious knowledge is phenomenally like is what is much more important when considering the nature of consciousness.
Certainly, when we use our cause and effect scientific instruments and senses to look for whatever it is that has this ineffable red in our brain, we shouldn't expect it to reflect 650 nanometer light. But certainly once we discover what it is that does have this ineffable property along with how it behaves, we will certainly be able to reproduce or 'eff' such in other minds, as described in the nature has phenomenal properties camp. At least if this 'phenomenal theory of consciousness' turns out to be the correct one.
Oh THAT is what salt tastes like, we might say after so effing. We also believe the most important thing to ask in a 'Turing Test' is merely something along the lines of: "What is red like for you?"


Edit summary : Add link to hard problem camp.
Submitted on :
Submitter Nick Name : Brent_Allsop
Go live Time :
Statement : Consciousness is the unified world of conscious knowledge or awareness composed of phenomenal properties of physical matter properly configured in our brain.
We believe perception is real, representative, and part of our brain. We agree with the 'Nature Has Ineffable Phenomenal Properties' camp on the hard problem. of consciousness.
When we look at a strawberry patch, there is something in our brain with red phenomenal properties representing the strawberries, and something with green phenomenal properties representing the green leaves. This 3D red and green knowledge or awareness in our brain is what enables us to consciously know where the best strawberries are in the patch of green leaves.
This red and green phenomenal knowledge unified into a 3D world of conscious awareness is the final result of the data processed from our senses. This phenomenal knowledge may also include additional semantic information such as the word for strawberry, a memory of sweetness for the reddest ones, and so on. This may also include the ability to retrospectively consider the nature of these red and green phenomenal properties, and the difference between them.
We believe that while these higher level introspective cognitive abilities and the semantic information attached to such phenomenal awareness is important, the raw phenomenal red and green phenomenal properties, and their categorical difference from mere behavior, is the most fundamentally important thing when considering what consciousness is.
Surely there is less intelligent life similarly using raw phenomenal properties to intelligently represent their world, without as many additional cognitive abilities which we have to retrospectively think about such. We believe such is what Thomas Nagal was referring to when he asked the question: "What is it like to be a bat". We of course know, behaviorally, what a bat is like. But what its conscious knowledge is phenomenally like is what is much more important when considering the nature of consciousness.
Certainly, when we use our cause and effect scientific instruments and senses to look for whatever it is that has this ineffable red in our brain, we shouldn't expect it to reflect 650 nanometer light. But certainly once we discover what it is that does have this ineffable property along with how it behaves, we will certainly be able to reproduce or 'eff' such in other minds, as described in the 'nature has phenomenal properties' camp. At least if this 'phenomenal theory of consciousness turns out to be the correct one.
Oh THAT is what salt tastes like, we might say after so effing. We also believe the most important thing to ask in a 'Turing Test' is merely something along the lines of: "What is red like for you?"


Edit summary : First Version
Submitted on :
Submitter Nick Name : Brent_Allsop
Go live Time :