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Hi PeerInfinity, thanks for all the work!
Thread Created at Aug 29th 2010, 11:38:10 pm | Started by PeerInfinity
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PeerInfinity replied 13 years ago (Aug 30th 2010, 2:55:27 am)
Yes, please email directly. (sending this now so that you can reply by email, and then I can reply to the rest of your last post by email)
Brent_Allsop replied 13 years ago (Aug 30th 2010, 2:51:43 am)
Hi Peer, When you initially registered, your identity information was marked public, so I got your e-mail address and name. But it looks like you changed all that to private? Would you mind if I e-mailed you directly? (Or you could just e-mail me brent.allsop at canonizer.com instead of responding here.) Yes, I agree and think something like canonizer.com is just what the world needs to solve most of it's problems so it all just makes sense to me. But I'm definitely finding out how the world is very different than me or us, and most people just don't many even can't get it. It is so surprising how some people, even after very long personal coaching, still can't figure anything out and don't have a clue. Yet people like you jump in and instantly know what to do and make great contributions right out of the box, with no coaching at all. I also thought it would reach critical mass and go viral long before now. Our biggest problem is there are still so few people that get it, using and promoting it. At least we're finally getting a few topics with some good examples of a few things this system can do. I so desperately want to know what others believe on controversial issues, but I'm finding most people seem to have no interest, whatsoever in what others think or value. Or they believe there is some mythical absolute truth, and all the controversy is a bad thing...??? But once they start seeing what the system can do, people will eventually 'get it'. All it takes is a few more people who get it to use it and run with it so we can reach critical mass and show them what we can do with it. Yes, there are lots of debate graph, and other types of systems that have been attempted over the years. I'd be interested in more specifics about what you'd like to do, beyond the simple wiki with added camps and survey capabilities to measure for types of consensus including scientific, moral expert, general population and so on system we have so far here. Another example is this [http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect2=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&d=PALL&RefSrch=yes&Query=PN%2F6347332 patent]. Evidently they started a web site based on that system back in 2000, but it obviously didn't go anywhere. I think most of all these systems are way to complex, and going after some mythical singular 'truth'. To me, simple measuring of consensus is the most important, especially since diverse values play so much of everything and what you want or hope is true. I think the best measure of truth, or the quality of any argument, is how convincing is it to everyone. Obviously some people think Joseph Smith is the Mormon Prophet of God, but not near as many people as accept general scientific principles... We need to rigorously measure all this, I think. I haven't looked into meta web and freebase much yet. Looks very interesting. That's cool that Google picked them up. I bet that made some people very rich. I'm sure there would be some greet integration possibilities with that. What could we do? You mentioned you created a node or camp for freebase, which you did do. The problem is is that the link you gave above was to www.test.canonizer.com. Any host name, *.canonizer.com, besides just canonizer.com, goes to the test system. Notice the red warning text at the top of all these test system pages. So if you remove the www.test from that URL, you'll find the camp you created on that topic on the main site. We haven't had any requests for access to the source code yet, so haven't yet put any effort to make it public. So far, when people are interested in contributing, or playing with the code, we give them remote linux login access to the test system, and their own personal running snapshot of the system to play with. If you're interested, just send me a login name, and we'll create a .canonizer.com version just for you that you can remote into and modify. Have you seen [http://canonizer.com/topic.asp/4 this page describing how we track any contribution to the system]? Since everything is free, our operating expenses are near zero. So any money we start to make beyond this (or if someone like Google buys us or gets involved?) we intend on distributing any such money to these shares according to people's contributions. You've definitely earned your first share so we've entered your first share in recognition of your contribution and interest in our recognition spreadsheet. Be sure to tack any time you spend contributing and let us know about such! We want to track all such as best as possible, especially any promotional efforts you may do. There is a link to this tracking spreadsheet in the above page so you can track such. As you can see, no promises necessary. Some people make a contribution, when they have time. Then come back a long time latter when they have time to do more... The more I work on this, the more ways I find this could make LOTS of money, I bet you'll also start to see some of these many ways it could be real big soon. I'm looking forward to hearing more of your great ideas, they sound like they are worth lots! Brent Allsop
PeerInfinity replied 13 years ago (Aug 30th 2010, 12:06:39 am)
Hi Brent :) Thanks for all your awesome work at canonizer, and thanks for contacting me. I heard about canonizer from this blog post: http://www.acceleratingfuture.com/michael/blog/2010/08/more-moral-realism-debates/ I think canonizer is awesome, and I'm surprised that there aren't more people using it. I should mention that before I heard of this site, I really wanted to start sometihng like it, but where people report their probability assessments for various claims, rather than choosing one camp to join on each topic. I actually started this project a few weeks ago, but haven't made much progress yet. I'm still in the process of pondering whether it would be possible to integrate that project with Canonizer somehow. Here's the project's URL: https://lifeboat.com/ex/x-risks-network also, have you considered integrating Canonizer with Freebase? I tried to create a canonizer node for that, but it seems to have disappeared. it was a subnode of this node: http://www.test.canonizer.com/topic.asp/104 oh, and the website says that Canonizer is open source, but I still haven't found where the source code is posted. I might consider helping with the coding, but I don't think I dare to make any promises yet. It's good to know you, and to know your values. Thanks Peer Infinity
Brent_Allsop replied 13 years ago (Aug 29th 2010, 11:38:10 pm)
Hi PeerInfinity Thanks for creating this camp, and all your other work here at canonizer.com making things so much better. I've wanted to join or create one like this rights for sentient beings camp for some time, but haven't had a chance yet, so it's great to have the help. Also, many of your other changes are great. I think moving the [http://canonizer.com/topic.asp/69/4 Comprehensive sex education is important] camp out from under the abstinence based sex camp is very appropriate. As one of the 9 camp supporters, I think this is definitely an improvement. I bet everyone else will agree, and that nobody in that camp will object, and that this change will go live after the 1 week review mode. If anyone does object, we can always fork the camp (create a new one with your improvements), and I'm sure most of the people will jump camps to your forked and improved version that is not supporting the abstinence based camp. It's good to know you, and to know your values. Thanks Brent Allsop